Originally by: Verite Rendition

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It's been a long time coming. I'm glad to see that speedtanking will no longer be the only effective way to fight in small groups.

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Originally by: Areo Hotah

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I am on the receiving end of (AAA) nano-hacs daily.
I have had an invasion of the old TRI in my space.

Observations from me fighting nano gangs:
-nobody takes booster pills
-Claymores are quite rare to see, and tend do die a lot.
-Hardly anyone uses snakes
-There are plenty of ways to kill (part of) a nanogang, without everybody being in a Rapier or Huginn. They bring a specialized ship to do something, so you have to do something specialized to counter them. Nothing wrong with that. No standard gang (some inties, ewar and DPS) should be able to counter 95% of enemy gang types. Eve should be rock-paper-scissors
-I like fighting them. Some people have even begun to count their kills in polycarbs/week.

I think there is nothing wrong with HACs going 3-5km/s.

I think there is nothing wrong with players investing 1Bn isk in snakes and going 8km/s.

I agree there is something wrong that practically every single HAC can go faster than a standard fitted inty.

There is nothing wrong with having speeds that makes you more or less immune to missiles and drones. These offensive weapons take minimal player skill to use (hence their popularity for mission runners), while good players can avoid the damage of turrets, simply by manual piloting (and vice versa, a good player in a turret boat can maximize his damage potential). A better solution would be to have significantly reduced damage, but not 0, for hurling missiles and drones at fast targets.

I think you should never ever nerf warfare links, as they are really a team-based module, and nerfing decreases the incentive to field one is bad. A good nano gang has a Claymore, so they go even faster. So what? Kill the Claymore first.

Nerfing all at once is bad (damps anyone?).
Just start by adjusting the polycarbs to be worse than t2 nanofibers, and modify the 3 "speed" stats (mass, max velocity, agility) into 2, so more stacking penalties get applied.

Making warp scramblers useful is good (maybe do something with warpcore stabs too).

Changing a web from 90% to 60% is a 400% nerf (max speed of webbed target from 10% to 40%); nothing in the history of eve has been nerfed so hard.

Once again, I fear that the Devs are listening too much to whines, without seeing the real problem. I think they should have focussed their time solely on their last "mission statement":
Guerrilla warfare must remain a viable combat tactic.
Please make more ways to make this possible, than simply nano'ing it up.

Cause:
Skilled players should be better than defending blob in crap ships.
Skilled defenders should be able to beat cookie-cutter setups.

Areo

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Originally by: Agmar

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Not to derail the thread, but a serious question. Has a thread ever gone this many pages within 24 hours?

/me puts the over/under at 78 pages in 24 hours

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Originally by: Agmar

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Originally by: Dungar Loghoth

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Originally by: Agmar

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Not to derail the thread, but a serious question. Has a thread ever gone this many pages within 24 hours?

/me puts the over/under at 78 pages in 24 hours

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How big was the whine thread on your forums when you lost Nebba's titan?

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About 1 post. Tell Space Flyer I said what's up.

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Originally by: DeadDuck

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I believe that DEVS know how the game is played, thats why they are introducing the changes. Blob away you say ? I remember the 50 nano hacs gangs you guys were using in Providence... Like you used to say ...ADAPT!

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Originally by: Yaay

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Actually, we had some terrible pilots account sharing supercapitals that day

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Originally by: Gneeznow

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It is a shame that most of this thread is PL going mad because of this when they have not given it a chance, they just see that they are not gonna be able to pwnpwnpwn with nano-zealots and snaked up Ishtar's and curses and now are throwing the rattle out of the pram, most of the PL in this thread fly almost nothing but speed ships with snakes despite them saying otherwise.

If you can afford to put expensive mods on a ship to make it go faster now, you'll be able to do it afterwards, and you will still be faster than less expensively equipped ships (post-patch)

the truth hurts eh I'll probably be burned alive by my PL brosef's later for this but it is the sad truth that abusive of nano-fleets like this by alliances like mine is what has caused this change.

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Originally by: OVERCOPES 1

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I find it amusing that all the people that are crying foul of these changes are the likes of pandemic legion,EXCEED AMD TRI.

They have made there name from this broken game mechanic and are now bleating like stuffed pigs about it getting BALANCED.

Good move CCP dont sway on this one.

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Originally by: Huan CK

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The scrambler change is a nice idea, but you'd want to increase their ranges further, since nanoships will make it easy to avoid those ranges.

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Originally by: CCP Dionysus

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Vagabond:
High: nothing
Med: 10mn microwarpdrive
Low: Overdrive Injector System II x2

Rigs: Auxilliary thrusters II x2

Implants. full snake set.

No special named modules etc.

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Originally by: Masked Shopper

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Edited by: Masked Shopper on 27/07/2008 04:18:36
IRC Battle Report

What the hell? Obviously this can't be allowed to happen. This nerf has been required for a long time so these "pvpers" abusing this totally overpowered tactic are put back to the same level as everyone else

How is it that a HAC gang can fight a gang of battleships and capitals head on and take minimal losses, especially with a titan on the field. This is dispicable and needs to end now.

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